Membership A Trial Run on No-Word Count

[Archivist 26]

@Uaithne thanks for the tip, for some reason I heard your words in the voice of Leonard Snart LOL

 

What am I looking for in posts? Content that can both move a story forward and inspire a member in their next post. Historically, this has been a strong-suit at The Org. It's not exactly an unwritten rule, it's one of those things that's 'just happened' so we go with it. And it's become something of an expectation among the members.

 

The word count was part of a package solution to the single paragraph posts. Aside from myself not liking it, there were a few members who messaged me saying it wasn't right that they contributed the heavy to a story while 'so and so' only posted a paragraph or two.

 

So, a solution was proposed-  add a word count minimum of 200 words then- for those who consistently wrote less, a collaboration section was added. This section was not effected by the word count- and serves as a spot for multi-writer scenarios. Over the years it's served us well. This is the write up on the description for the section:

 

Quote

Collaborations Arena 
This section is reserved for multiple writer joint points. It is open for anyone to start a joint post with 2 or more writers. Treat them like 'add a paragraph stories.' then post the scenario to the story thread they belong to. The person who starts the collaboration is the one to post it to the thread.

 

Why I don't like 1 paragraph posts is simple. When one person is allowed to do it- it's only a matter of time before others see that it's allowed to slide. If they don't complain that it's not fair, they start producing less and the next thing we know, everyone is posting single paragraphs. This happened on my site and with this person being an admin, just made it worse. Members followed her example. The next thing I knew, I was getting PMs saying my posts were 'too long.'

 

In the progression of this conversation- I've come to realize one thing. I'm breaking one of my own rules. And I really hate when I do this. So, I've decided not to cancel the word minimum but something needs to happen.

 

I'm not ready to pack it in with this, it means to much to me. Members have come and gone for various reasons, and the site has endured.

 

My next question would take this conversation off the original topic. I should probably start another thread.

Edited December 17, 2017 by Archivist

[Morrigan 1,826]

And that's fair, it's your site @Archivist this is why many people in this thread alone recommend you talk to your memberbase about such a large change.

 

It's always best to ask what your members want over what people who have never (and may never) join your site want.

[Uaithne 543]

I'm glad we could help, haha.  I never thought I'd be trying to convince someone to keep a word count. @Archivist

[Archivist 26]

Just now, Uaithne said:

I'm glad we could help, haha.  I never thought I'd be trying to convince someone to keep a word count. @Archivist

 

 

Stranger things have happened. I've done and said things I never thought I would.

[Archivist 26]

@Morrigan

 

 

This reply is on a personal level- I just finishing reading your long post up there- and I'm actually cringing from those numbers. Yes, me a 'counter, cringing at someone's expected word count. Why? I'm a writer and I separate my various writings. There's my novels, my academics, my short short-stories, and my RPG. 

 

"They were 600... 900... 1500.... 2000 and I'm not exaggerating."

 

I believe you, these are normal writing goals for me when I'm working on novels, novellas, and short stories. My academics go by the pages- I have to guess-timate the count of the words for my trackers. Yes, I actually have a word tracker file. Only one academic program works on word counting. It's about writing short stories and articles for publication in magazines and other periodicals. Each lesson has a preset word count. I can have within 10% less but not more. My current lesson, by itself is 3,000 words.

 

I would squeal like a schoolgirl if I hit 2,000 in one day for one of my projects. LOL

< glances to the side at Athena kitty>

 

BUT NOT FOR MY RPG!

 

The RPG stories are my go-to when I'm stuck in writer's block on my projects for college or publication. I want to have fun with these stories, just relax, let go, and throw away the plan.

 

It's like Hollow says with every new story in Psionics: "No plot, no plan, no problem."

 

The idea, for me personally, is to force my imagination to shift from one project to another- put that novel on the back burner for the sub-conscious.

 

I am the only actual writer on my site. I cannot reasonably expect the members to write on my level. That would be unfair and an unreasonable expectation.

 

So, when the word count minimum was agreed on- 200 was the magic number for all involved at the time and it has stuck for 15 years. Folks who don't feel that they can reach this typically go to the collaboration area and ask for a JP- and often, while not required- include an open paragraph to start it off.

[Morrigan 1,826]

3 minutes ago, Archivist said:

The RPG stories are my go-to when I'm stuck in writer's block on my projects for college or publication. I want to have fun with these stories, just relax, let go, and throw away the plan.

 

Congratulations, you now know what a no word count roleplayer wants and understand it better.

 

Legit, that is why no word count is so important. There was a time when those were minimums to be considered a REAL roleplayer. Most roleplayers that enjoy no word count have your mantra that I quoted above.

 

They want no obligations, no requirements, nothing to hinder plot progression. We just want to enjoy writing and that's it. The amount of words I write to move something forward in a mutual plot should not now nor ever hinder it.

[Death Kitten 200]

I will say it honestly: I think word counts are the wrong solution to a legitimate problem. I used to have a word count, but I axed it the more I looked at word count culture. I also realized that the people who were causing the most friction in the games I'd been involved in, or the games I ran, weren't necessarily failing to meet word count. They often were just padding their tags with all manner of useless crap, often times burying the parts that my characters would actually be able to observe or just out and out giving me nothing to work with.

 

Yes, there are some people who will literally give you nothing to respond to when they reply back. There are also people who will give you a short reply that advances the thread, but there are also people who will give you nothing when they write you paragraphs and paragraphs worth of reply. Everyone in the RP community comes for different reasons, they approach the writing different, and sometimes they'll have conflicting styles. This unfortunately means that not everyone is going to be happy writing together, and that's okay.

 

All that said, I def agree with everyone saying that you need to figure out what's right for your community based on what your existing members want. Chasing hypothetical new members by killing your word count (but semi-leaving it by expecting a certain number of sentences or paragraphs, even if not numerically defined) is likely to find people who have a different RP style than you and your existing members. I know how hard it can be to have a small group of users, but take care of that group and you'll have loyal friends and writers to share your joy with. It's more rewarding in the long run anyways.

[Archivist 26]

To be honest, I don't think that the fluff and crap writing have anything to do with the word count. As one of my instructors said. "Crap is crap, no matter how many pages."

 

Another thing considered was - does having a word count say that the staff doesn't trust members to not post decent lengths in a scenario? Some would say yes, some say no.

 

It comes down to what the one poster in this thread said- quality vs quantity.

 

To me, a high word counts opens a site up for poor quality. It's one of the reason ours is low. We don't push people to go beyond, sometimes it just happens- and that's great. Sometimes it's complete crap, with nothing to do with the story in the thread- and sometimes it takes the story forward while moving in an unexpected direction.

 

If there is an interest I wold set up a section specifically "ad a sentence' stories. I've been involved in one of these once before and by the end of it- there was a giant green chicken rampaging down the Vegas strip- it was hilarious. So,. one sentence stories have their place and merit.

 

It becomes a problem when you're participating in a thread where the count is consistently over 200 words, at least, and then someone comes along and posts - lets say 25 to 50 words. For some RPers- this sends the message that the person wants someone else to carry the weight of the story- not them.  As I said, this has happened in my group and our solution was the collaboration section. And it has and does work.

Edited December 17, 2017 by Archivist

[Morrigan 1,826]

No it doesn't cause the problem that you see with the "constant count over 200" for me that isn't a problem as long as my one sentence is still good enough.

 

The problem with word count people versus non-word count people isn't the word count... it's the inspiration factor.

 

You don't need to know what my character is thinking to know how to progress a plot.

[Archivist 26]

No, not in general terms- personally though, I need something more than "Message from Starfleet, Captain."

 

I remember one time, in an AOhell chat- this person came into the chat and posted: 

 

In walks a teenage boy and he's got fire power.

 

The posts that followed were things like WTF? and emoji's with confused expression, and a number of these o.0 or 0.o

The person left but the reactions were comical- stopped the story dead in it's tracks. I thought it was funny.

[Morrigan 1,826]

I guess I don't understand and things you are posting now are out of context.

[Archivist 26]

My examples?

 

Blame the hour, It's 1 am for me- I shuld've been in bed hours ago.

[Morrigan 1,826]

Meh, hour and soberness mean little to me. Post when you're more coherent and I can reply in a way that more accurately counters or explains or justifies what you are saying.

 

Unfortunately no one thinks:

"Message from Starfleet, Captain."

Is a good post unless that comes with "came a message from the nearby panel to get the persons attention" so your context is skewed or you're making stuff up to be right, no offense.

[Archivist 26]

No offense taken- it's just an example that I've actually seen.  Fortunately the person caught edited- and over the years a damn good role-player evolved. We lost contact with Fed Intel dissolved.

[Morrigan 1,826]

So you're telling me that the post didn't mean anything.

 

I mean I've set out challenges (personally) for players to start a thread in 1 word. I've seen some of the best threads evolve from those threads. Really connecting, really inspiring and really good characters.

 

So I repeat that inspiration is personal. I know people (and they have expressed themselves in this thread) that can't get inspired without at least 200+ words. For me. You give me a word and tell me a location and I'm more inspired than any 200 word post can be. So all in all, it all comes down to preference and how YOU want to play.

 

To provide an example I've started a thread on a Star Trek site with a Scotty character that that just said "Fuck" and one of the best threads he ever had evolved from that. No super starter. No explanation of where he was or what he was doing. It all evolved during the thread.